GV650 issues

[Dave]

Hi eveyone,

I have a 2013 efi GV650 with some problems.

Ok first off I bought a “repairable write off”

So the engine was absolute trash, big chunks of metal through the oil and a big rattling sound.

But it still ran.

Not worth repairing the engine.

I purchased a second engine from a 2006 carby GV650.

It was running fine and sounded strong.

Got it home and ripped the old engine out and installed the new engine. Nothing else changed. I changed a couple sensors from the efi engine to make the electrical hookups compatible.

Got everything together and now i have nothing. The engine turns over but doesn’t fire. There’s no spark at the plugs despite new plugs.

Also when ignition is switched on the fuel pump doesn’t turn on.

I’ve obviously done something wrong. Can anyone point me in the right direction? Is the carby engine compatible with the efi setup?

I’ve got power where power needs to be etc.

 

Do i need an efi engine?

 

Many many thanks in advance.

Dave

[Simon]

The problem is going to be ECU, you need a carb one, the wiring loom is going to be completely different yes the indicators, lights etc are going to be pretty much the same but it’s all the rest of it that’s going to be a problem. I’m pretty sure the carb one doesn’t run an electric fuel pump & it won’t work because the ECU won’t fire it up because there’s no signal from all the sensors during load up. Personally I would try to fit the efi stuff to the engine which I would assume can be done (without a real life look I don’t know) Marcel will probably have a better understanding.

[Dave]

Simon wrote:

The problem is going to be ECU, you need a carb one, the wiring loom is going to be completely different yes the indicators, lights etc are going to be pretty much the same but it’s all the rest of it that’s going to be a problem. I’m pretty sure the carb one doesn’t run an electric fuel pump & it won’t work because the ECU won’t fire it up because there’s no signal from all the sensors during load up. Personally I would try to fit the efi stuff to the engine which I would assume can be done (without a real life look I don’t know) Marcel will probably have a better understanding.

Quote

Hi there, thanks for your reply.

The carby engine was put back into the efi frame.

I have refitted all the efi equipment as if if was original.  I had to change the neutral sensor over and i replaced starter and water pump from the original engine.

Everything is connected as original. I’m not using carbys at all.

I would have thought this set up would have worked.

Sorry if i didn’t make myself clear.

Have checked the ro sensor but can’t get a resistance reading from it. Also checked the side stand switch and have no voltage there either.

I tried jumping both ro sensor and the side stand switch to no avail.

 

Could there be any internal sensors on the efi engine that are not on the carby engine?

I know an efi engine is backward compatible to a carby.

 

Thanks for your input

[Dave]

Ok so i had a (possible) brain wave.

 

When i changed the engine to the older engine i didn’t change the stator to the original one out of the efi engine.

So it still has the original carby model stator in it.

Upon some research around the interwebs thingy it would seem that the carby stator and the efi stator are different and not compatible with each engine.

 

Am i onto something here? Or is it negligible differences?

As i still have the old (trashed) engine i can still rob for parts.

 

Thanks again. 🤔🤔🤔

[♠️ MARCEL]

Was the ECU Delphi? And all electronics have delphi branding on it

 

Or if you want post a picture of the ECU ,  stator of the wrecked engine and its flywheel.

 

It could likely be the stator unit compatibility with ECU due to fact certain stators want certain ECUs.

The stator and ECU are the 2 to talk to each other while cranking to make pulse timings

Then ECU primes the fuel pump and wakes up all other electrics to make flames (sparks) to get her going

 

The carby vs efi engine = purely the actually sensors on the motor to switch. (ET sensor , if its there on the head. Some dont have it.  Stator unit, NEUTRAL sensor (efi tends to have 6 dots on it. Carby gearbox sensors tend to have 1 dot or 5)

 

Regards

// Meditation doesn't mean you have to sit still....

[Dave]

♠️ MARCEL wrote:

Was the ECU Delphi? And all electronics have delphi branding on it Or if you want post a picture of the ECU , stator of the wrecked engine and its flywheel. It could likely be the stator unit compatibility with ECU due to fact certain stators want certain ECUs. The stator and ECU are the 2 to talk to each other while cranking to make pulse timings Then ECU primes the fuel pump and wakes up all other electrics to make flames (sparks) to get her going The carby vs efi engine = purely the actually sensors on the motor to switch. (ET sensor , if its there on the head. Some dont have it. Stator unit, NEUTRAL sensor (efi tends to have 6 dots on it. Carby gearbox sensors tend to have 1 dot or 5) Regards

Quote

Hi Marcel,

Thanks for your reply. All the sensors are the ones from the original engine.

Yes the ECU is a delphi and i didn’t swap the stator.

As you’ve said these are all.matched units so that’s my next mission. Change the stators over.

So all the sensors, efi etc are from the original efi bike/engine.

It will take a couple of days till i can do this so will post an update then.

Thanks so much.

[Dave]

Also i just had a look at the trashed engine.

It would seem i did replace the stator unknowingly as it’s attached to the side cover. I changed the side covers because i liked the black better than the chrome of the carby version.

I didn’t replace the flywheel. Is this critical?

There was no ET sensor on the head.

I changed the water pump, neutral sensor and the starter motor.

Thanks again

[♠️ MARCEL]

Have a look at the flywheels.  Korea is known to use delphi specific flywheels to go with delphi stators but…..  If both flywheels match. It should run.

 

Another hint is that flywheel may have 8 timing tabs on it vs 3 to 4 tabs on a carby rotor.

 

Thats why when i sell stator kits for 650cc i usually say up to 2013 & No delphi bikes.

Ironically 2013 is when delphi entered the scene too.  The plugs for stators change in later years especially on the 250cc variants.

 

For delphi = usually best to marry the rotor and stator together unless Korea left the old rotor inside 2013s and just made it run on delphis.

 

Ill verify this later on when i return to office to check 2013-2014 models

 

I also know 10000% delphi stators and older stators have different diamater sizes marginally (eg. 80mm vs 85mm)  expect timing sensors to change too.

// Meditation doesn't mean you have to sit still....

[Dave]

Hi i have taken some photos of the original efi flywheel.  I’m not sure what the timing tabs are but i imagine they are the raised tabs around the edge. There are 23 of them.

Not sure about the one currently installed in the engine. Will have to wait a few days for that.

To remove the flywheel i just take off the one bolt in the center? Or do i undo the cap screws around the center.

 

[Geoffrey]

I’m pretty sure you will need the Hyosung special tool to remove it.  There is a picture of it and a part number if you download the workshop manual from this site.  I need to source one myself to repair the starter clutch problem on mine.  There are some how-to-do-it (or possibly how NOT to do it) videos on YouTube, and I think I looked at one for the Suzuki SV650, the engine of which is very similar.  Don’t be tempted to prise it off as one Indian YouTuber was doing with two tyre levers and big hammer!

[♠️ MARCEL]

The carby rotor + stator are married.   Hyosung generally doesn’t sell the rotors on their own , they slowly removed references to order them , so we can only get complete assemblies.

Now it means if your EFi was working with EFi Rotor + EFi stator =  Take those 2 and put them in the carby motor.

// Meditation doesn't mean you have to sit still....

[Dave]

Thanks everyone,

I’ll have a go at replacing the rotor on thursday when i get time. If not then I’ll have to do it when I’m next gome in a few weeks.

 

Thanks for the great help and info.

[Jason]

Probably already sorted but the flywheels between the carby, daewoo and delphi bikes are all different.  To my knowledge the stators in all are the same.  Pickup sensors are interchangable between daewoo and delphi.  Not sure with a carby bike.

 

The problem will be with the flywheel.

[Dave]

thanks for the good info.

I’m just at the pub having lunch then will head back home and put the original one from the efi engine in. Got it mostly apart then got thirsty.

 

Will update when/if i get it working

[Dave]

Hi all,

Just wanted to update on Betty.

So to remove the rotor i had to fabricate my own removal tool. Pictured below. The rear engine mounting bolt is the same thread and pitch so i just cut one shorter.  Worked perfectly.

I also found out that the ring gear in behind the rotor is slightly different as well.

Got them changed over and put it all back together.

Filled up fluids and fuel tank etc back on.

Kicked it in the guts and guess what happened?

 

It fired right up and settled straight into a very happy burble.

Absolutely love the sound.

So a big learning curve and wouldn’t have been able to do it without all of your help. Thanks so much.

 

[♠️ MARCEL]

Sounds like you should make a tutorial for your future owners who may stumble upon this thread for help too.

I am very pleased you got it going!

Time for a quick test ride ?

// Meditation doesn't mean you have to sit still....

[Dave]

♠️ MARCEL wrote:

Sounds like you should make a tutorial for your future owners who may stumble upon this thread for help too. I am very pleased you got it going! Time for a quick test ride ?

Quote

 

Hahaha already taken it for a test ride.

The torque on it is awesome. Lots of power.

 

You couldn’t wipe the smile off my face at all.

 

Thanks

[♠️ MARCEL]

Pimping out Betty begins! 😉 not that it does as its stunning already in a sleeper look!

// Meditation doesn't mean you have to sit still....

[Author]

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